The Interview :: Five

But Canada makes a point of it. I think right now, the majority of Canadians say, "It doesn't affect me. I'm not interested in exposing the Masonic Lodge, or the Illuminati, or the elite. It doesn't affect me." But you see, this is what in every society eventually had a breakdown of society and lost their freedoms, that's what all the people say. In Russia and Germany, etcetera.

At first the people say, "It doesn't affect me, so I don't want to sacrifice, or I don't want to do what's necessary to correct this injustice." But believe me, Canadian's will find out the heat will get very, very big in Canada. And I think it will happen, probably the real hard times will come the same times they come to the United States. But there's going to be inevitable over the next few years, escalation of the taking away of the rights of the people of Canada.

How soon do you think that's coming?

I believe that there very well could be a contrived financial chaos very soon. It may be that what has happened in Asia in the markets will cause a domino effect.

That's interesting that you mention that, because in Canada, or in Vancouver rather, just a couple weeks ago we had the APEC conference, the Asia Pacific Economic Co-operation conference, that occurred just at the same time that a lot of that was going on.

Yeah, you know the Prime Minister of Malaysia made a speech that the New World Order boys hated. In fact, he spoke -- it may have been at APEC, I'm not sure -- I have a full, the full address. But he blamed the money speculators for the fall, the currency speculator George Soros and others, for the fall of Asia.

I remember that speech.

He said, "The thing that they want to do is keep us Asians down." It appears as if we were going to attain the economic status of the Europe and North America. This could not be allowed. And therefore, the super-rich did this on purpose, and drove us into the ground." And I'm paraphrasing, but that's what he said. And James Wolfenson, the International Monetary, excuse me, of the World Bank, you know, sat there, and they said a scowl was across his face. And Kim Dessus, of the France, of the, you know, the IMF, the same way, they hated this guy saying that.

But it's true. But I believe, you see, labour is so cheap over there. And they've got to keep it cheap. They can't allow Thailand and Malaysia and Indonesia to rise in their levels of income. Why, then they couldn't pay twenty-five cents an hour to slave workers. So they drove those countries down. And some people say that they're going to do, that if it works over there, then they'll do it in Canada and the United States next. Because they don't really want to pay fourteen, fifteen dollars an hour to a Canadian auto worker, do they, if they can get it cheaper.

Right now, they, there's a certain amount, of course, the plants and the factories being sent overseas. Now that has happened too, but there's only so much of that that you can do. And so, I really think that they're probably going to equalize things around the world. So probably we're next.

Okay. Um, something else I wanted to ask: a lot of your opinions, at least politically, seem to correlate with things that people on the left of the spectrum, we'll call it, would say. Especially the concerns about international movement of finances, and the keeping of a cheap labour pool in Asia, things like this. Now, you said earlier that when it comes to dealing with the elite there's no such thing as left or right, it takes a concerted effort to battle them. But how do you feel about, about sharing these political views, or perhaps working, if not directly in tandem, at least with a certain shared spirit with people who don't share your religious views?

I really do. I am amazed at the number-- I go in, I go in New Age bookstores and liberal bookstores and find my books. I think a certain number of people, and I get some internet stuff, you know, the people are sending out on different channels, and I'll get the typical liberal letter will say something like, "You've got to read Texe Marrs' newest book, Project L.U.C.I.D. Now, there is a certain amount in the book that you'll just want to brush off. This guy is a religious fanatic. However, his documentation exposing Big Brother and secret societies and the New World Order is fantastic. So you know, try to stomach what he says about Jesus and all that, and you know, take that with a grain of salt, and you know, take in the other."

So you know, that's sort of their attitude. But you know, that gives me an opportunity to say, "Well, you know, those people will be reading my books, and we'll see what God does." Because, you know, I don't have any-- I mean, I'm not responsible for their salvation anyway. God is, and it's up to them. So I just do what I do and let it work.

There's also many, many magazines that are very New Age, liberal area type magazines, and they have done very favourable reviews of my books. This has only happened, I would say, the last three or four years it's gathered steam. I think, you know, remember: back in the sixties and the seventies, particularly, the sixties particularly, the left wing warned about the global elite of the rich. They warned about the monied element. They warned about the use of government intelligence agencies and the police state.

Now these people are older. They're in their forties and fifties. And some of them were sort of lulled to sleep and became part of the new paradigm. You know, they were sort of seduced by the Clintons and the Gores who seem to talk the sixties language to them. They said, "Oh, isn't this wonderful? Now, one of our own is in office."

But suddenly to their horror, they found out that the FBI budget has gone up tremendously. The CIA has not been dismantled. And the Cold War is over, but suddenly satellites, many, many hundreds of millions of dollars are going to satellite surveillance. What's going on? Why, why, why is this going? And so there is now a new, Hugh, a new evaluation. And they're coming to their senses in droves.

Now, I will admit, they-- Hugh, get their books, they'll talk, I've seen these New Agers, they have their books warning about the New World Order. They'll add a little stuff in about karma and reincarnation and this silliness [laughter]. But still there is a recognition that they have. You know when I mentioned the unwashed masses of the environmental movement? I wasn't trying to be critical. And let me tell you why.

Let me give you some skeletons in my closet. I led a campaign fifteen years ago here in Austin, Texas, to save trees! I fought developers who wanted to cut huge swaths of trees. Right? And I still want to keep things like that. But, but I suddenly realized who is behind, I found out who was behind the environmental movement. And their goals are not like the average good-hearted environmentalist. These people are using the environmental movement.

See, they say, "We've got to have a world environmental authority. This problem of global warming and everything goes across national borders. And this world environmental authority has to have powers. So we have to have a world court. And of course since the laws don't work so good, we've got to have a global authority. We've got to empower the United Nations, maybe we've got to have many, many more treaties. We've got to bind down the people. We've got-- So suddenly-- And another thing, too, we can't let private property owners control their property. Why--"

You know, I don't know what your laws are there, but let -- Can I give you an example? My ministry bought a five-acre tract of land. Five acres. It's on a five-lane highway. There's subdivisions, there's office buildings close to what the first one would have

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land-locked by the subdivisions, houses and highways on all four sides. We wanted to build a new ministry building. Five acres, we were probably going to only use one acre and leave the rest natural and pretty. As I said, it's in a metropolitan area. It's on the outskirts of the city here, but it's metropolitan. Certainly not out in some forest. In the city of Austin, it's in the city limits.

Well, the city said, "Great!" The county said, "Great!" The state of Texas said, "No problem!" But! The U.S. Fish and Wildlife service said, "No, no. No, no, no. We have to protect the golden-cheeked warbler." I said, "There's no such bird, there's not even any bird nest on this property. Certainly not on the one acre or so that we want to build on." They said, "But you don't understand. Now we have the Endangered Species Act. And we have found that this bird is in this area of Texas. It's in an area about three hundred square miles. And you know, it could possibly fly and land on your property, and land in a tree. Therefore, we cannot allow you to use your property, because this bird may land there. It is habitat. Protected habitat."

I said, "But there's no nest. And no one in this area has ever seen this bird." They said, "Well, that's the point: it's so endangered. It's very rare. But, you know, I'm sorry, you can never, ever, ever for the rest of human history use your property." I said, "Well, then I don't have to pay property taxes." They said, "Oh, yes you do. Of course! You own it." I said, "Well, can I cut down a tree?" "Not anything." "Can I mow it?" "No, you can't mow it either. You must leave it in its natural state." I said, "But there's cars. You stand on the top of this lot and the traffic is horrible! In fact, we were thinking, you know, how we were going to soundproof the walls." They said, "Yes, we know that. But still, it's in our quadrant of territory here, even though it's a metro area."

And they told me-- And I said, "Well, now, the U.S. constitution says, in the fifth amendment, that private property may not be taken from a citizen without due process of law and then only with just compensation paid." You know, if they wanted to take your property, Hugh, up there in Canada, and build a library, would they have to pay you?

I should think so, yeah.

Okay. So I said, "So you want my property to protect this bird, because it's for the public good." They said, "That's right." They said, "We don't want your property. We're going to let you keep it." And there is the catch-22. They said, "We're not taking your property. It's still yours, Mr. Marrs, you and your ministry's. But you can never use it! Ever! For all of human history." Or, of course, until the great American empire falls.

And I said, "But this violates the constitution." And they said, "Oh no, the constitution says we can't take your property. We're not taking it. We're letting you keep it. And you're going to be allowed to keep it and protect this bird for the rest of your life." Well, you know, we went to try to sell that property. And nobody wanted to buy it. Who would want to buy it? You can't even build a nature trail on it.

So, this is, these are new laws in America. This was unheralded. Environmentalists loved it. They eat it up. And now there are plans called, there's a wildlands project. Ultimately they want eighty percent of America to be wildlands -- uninhabitable -- to protect the species. But what if there are farms and roads and towns and villages? They must be grazed over and left. And did you know that in Chicago outside the city, there's a huge area of forest? And they estimate there's seventy thousand trees there.

I didn't know that.

It's just a nice area. But the environmentalists now have all gotten together, environmental organizations -- they're demanding those seventy thousand trees be cut down. They say that the western, the middle western part of the United States used to be plains and prairie grass. And they want, and, but because people planted trees in metropolitan Chicago, seeds drifted in the wind and this forest, they say, is probably less that a hundred and fifty years old. And therefore it's an artificial forest. [laughter] And they want all the trees cut down and grazed so that the prairie grass can grow again like it used to be. Now I don't know, Hugh, do you call that environmentalism? They want to cut down seventy thousand trees.

They can't seem to make up their mind.

But actually, I did on my radio program, I did agree with them that it should be returned to its native state which was glaciers. Ice. Which means they must all leave the United States at once. And somehow we must allow America and Canada to return to the Ice Age. Isn't that the way it all was?

I can't imagine that getting a warm reception from the environmentalists.

No, no, it really didn't. And by the way, the newest thing here in America -- I don't know about Canada -- is to blow up all the dams. They want all the dams to go. And they've actually been successful in their first one, and now they've targeted all the dams. Once the water has run free and everything, and laid [?] all the land and everything, it all returns to its native state. Oh, how about all the hundreds of thousands of people who will lose their homes? That's just too darn bad, isn't it?

And of course, the-- Here again, we get to some very strange things-- is in the interests of certain elites to have it so, I might add. For example, like Canada. Canada and Alaska must have huge stores of oil. But you know, environmentalists don't want you to go up there and get that oil. And do you really think that Exxon, the Rockefellers, Exxon, do you really think that they want to get that oil? No! If they went up there and got that oil, the price of gasoline may drop to fifteen cents. They're more than willing for the environmentalists to win out.

Hmm.

So this is what's going on around the world, as more and more farmland is taken up here in the United States, and the small farmers put out of business, the huge conglomerates, agri-business, owned by the elite, will control all of the food supplies. So they're more than willing for all the dams to break, the water to flow, farmers to be put out of business, and that's why, you know, they had huge flooding in America last year. None of those dykes were rebuilt. The Clinton administration refused to rebuild any dykes.

Now we have El Nino. They're saying that in January, February and March, especially March, there will be tremendous flooding. And all of those people will be, it will all happen all over again and even worse. The environmentalists don't want the dykes to be built. They say the farms should have never been there. They want it to be natural like it used to be, without the dykes and the dams. And the Clinton administration, being environmentally crazy -- and, I might add, controlled by the elite -- want it to be so. The price of food will skyrocket, the agribusiness concerns will profit, and they will be very, very happy.

All of this in order to bring about a global depopulation?

Well, the global depopulation will make it easier for the elite to control us. I believe we see this in Africa. I call it the killing of Africa. What happened in Rwanda and Burundi? One million people slaughtered. I want you to imagine the Presidents of Rwanda and Burundi were invited to a conference. They came back as friends, flying back in the same aircraft. Nobody knows what happened, but the aircraft exploded in midair. Some people believe it was a missile. Both the presidents were killed.

And then suddenly, many people say the United Nations workers instigated massacres, setting tribes against tribes. And many, many people believe, of course, the World Health Organization began the AIDS epidemic, and that there is experimentation with Ebola and others, always in Africa.

And I call it the killing of Africa. You know, I call it -- I believe what's going to happen is the recolonization of Africa. It will be more smooth this time. This time they will use the Mandelas. You know, before they had their white people in office. Now they will have their black slaves in office. The Mandelas kiss the boots of the Rockefellers and Rothschilds. When Rothschild says, "Jump," Mandela says, "How high, Bwana?" And that's the way it is, Hugh, in Africa.

People said when, when Mandela goes into power, the Rothschilds and the De Beers diamond mines and gold mines will be taken over by the government and nationalized. I knew better than that. I told everyone, that's stupid. I had people that said gold will go to five thousand dollars an ounce because South Africa's gold mines will be closed when Mandela takes office. I said that's stupid.

Mandela is owned by these people. And he's a communist and he's owned by these people, and they'll, he'll do whatever they say in the end. In the end he does whatever they say. And he hasn't touched their diamond mines or gold mines. And he won't.

So, so we have this situation worldwide -- I know in Canada there, your huge hydro waterworks is controlled by Maurice Strong, who is the, was the head of the environmental program of the United Nations. He now is in charge of Kofi Anan, the UN Secretary-General's United Nations reform program. So Maurice Strong is a Canadian and one of the elite, although I do believe he is just a small man. But, but he's very powerful in the UN, in some of these bureaucracies, but his money was given to him by the elite. But they're -- Why are they interested in water? The water companies there in Canada? Why are they being controlled?

Presumably to, to just have one more method of control of the population.

Absolutely.

Water and food.

[garbled] I'm convinced of that. And they do. They really do. At the same time [garbled] Canadian, has control of water rights for most of the state of Colorado. And right now, there are court suits going on in Colorado, the little people taking Maurice Strong to court, claiming that he has plans to siphon off water, you know, and dry up thousands and thousands of acres owned by other people. He owns, because he owns certain water rights, of aqueducts, of spring systems under the ground, because he owns tremendous numbers of acreage of property in the Baca Grande region of Colorado.

How did he get that? How did he get the hydro works there in Canada? How did he become the United Nations environmental program director? How did he become the founder and organiser of the United Nations, the Earth Summit down in Rio de Janeiro in 92 or so? These are all questions that I think can be answered if you understand the goals of the elite.

To control the earth they need to cause people to believe in a grand program of globalism. And the environmental -- I think that is what they latched on to today, the environmental movement. And so you can quote Texe Marrs, an original environmentalist, who was a tree-saver in Austin, Texas.

But I got, I got born again off that. Because I began to realize, and I did not want to be con-- to help these men, and especially taking away private property. And, and you know, I want to mention to you, no one seems to feel sorry for a big lumber company when the government says you can't cut down trees, you know, in this huge area. Aw, who cares?